Hello from Bear & Curadh, a podcast from the Land of Awes Information Services.
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I love you, Curadh.
I love you, Bear.
This is episode 89 of the Bear and Curadh podcast.
We're going to talk about the gay community.
How do you feel about the gay community?
Um, very complicated answer.
Okay.
We got plenty of time.
Like society in general, I guess we get what we put into it.
Um, I used to be an activist back in the beginnings of the AIDS pandemic.
And I saw people organize and, um, and support each other when no one else would.
I also saw people of the gay community who would eat each other.
Um, I think I may have mentioned this once before, um, in the movie "Bros" that was popular
last year.
Um, one of the characters belong to, uh, a gay community group, like a pride group.
And in the movie, they depicted this group of people who were all squab- squab- squab- squab- squab- squab- squabbling.
Um, trying to, trying to, um, organize and- and do something positive, but each one had
their own little agenda and there was lots of bickering and infighting.
So, they kind of see the forest to a tree?
Yeah, um, that's exactly the way it is.
Um, um, during the age crisis, I saw lesbians step up when no one else would.
Really?
Um, I mean, a whole generation of gay men died.
Oh, yeah.
Um, do you think the community is as strong as it was now as it was then, or?
No.
I don't really think it is.
I think a new generation came along, not realizing the sacrifices that came before.
Yeah.
I would agree.
It's too bad.
Do you think they just overlooking now?
Do you think they- do they just, at a sight out of mind?
Surely, they know.
Do it hope.
I don't think they do, though.
I mean, you don't hear about the AIDS epidemic at all or pandemic.
It's not gone.
No.
It's just, it's a, it's a, it's a little disease now.
Before it was a death sentence.
Now it's a manageable condition, like diabetes or high blood pressure or something.
Which is good.
Yeah.
Oh, yeah.
I mean, we would still welcome a cure.
Maybe if I was part of that younger community, I would no better have an answer.
Yeah.
That's what I was going to say when, about the gay community right now, I mean, you really
aren't in it.
We're in our kind of a little bubble, aren't we?
So many gay men of my age got so burned out.
Understandably.
Would you like to come more active in it?
I'd, I'd like to join Sage.
We talked about it, seniors in a gay environment, basically a support group for older gay people.
Okay.
Well, I'm not quite there yet.
You're older than me.
I'm decent.
I don't consider myself a senior yet.
Well, let's move on to the next question.
I think it's important.
Okay.
What are the messages that come out of the gay community really to sex?
That's what I was kind of hitting about, that being in a bubble.
I'm not sure really anymore.
I think it's so open and free.
Do what you want when you want to do it, especially with dating apps.
Now that they have for one-night hookups, but like I said, you know, at a site out of mind,
you're just being together for over 10 years now, so we haven't really been dating.
How do you, I'm, I've got, I've got another take on that.
The sex is really the only thing that unites us, come.
Something like other communities like African-Americans or people with disabilities or anything.
You can't just look at a gay person and decide that they're gay or figure out in most cases.
And unlike bankers and lawyers and plumbers, we have nothing in common except sex.
How we love is the only thing we have in common.
So, it is easy to be divisive for some, you have some A-gays and some D-gays.
The pretty ones get, you know, all the benefit of the doubt, the ugly ones are cast out.
That's what I meant by eating our own.
It, it does make it extremely hard to unify people when, when love is the only thing they
have in common.
And do you think that's a problem?
It's always been a problem.
Okay.
It's kind of hard to rally around something when the only thing that you really have in common
is sex.
Or I suppose a shared animus, we have our enemies and we've always had our enemies.
And so, I guess one thing to unite us is to oppose the enemy.
Yeah.
It's our foe.
That's a good take on it.
And I never really thought about it that way.
So, like when you say A-gays and T-gays and all that and you're talking about like books and
stuff like that.
Yeah.
I guess so.
I mean the gay community can be really shitty towards each other too.
They can?
Yeah.
I want to be.
Nothing really.
But like before I mean like right now, I mean are gay bars even really popular anymore?
Oh, they're going out of business in record numbers.
Because you have all these online hookups I mean or it's becoming more and more.
Before it was gay bars were a safety play.
A safe zone.
A safe zone to go.
Well now.
A place to meet people.
And now you have all these online apps that you can join and meet other gay people and
it's more seriously except the board.
You can go to the quote unquote straight bar and be a gay man and meet other gay men there
before it was just you go to a gay bar to do that.
Or do you need to look here looking around like you disagree?
No.
I'm just thinking of things.
I don't know if I want to bring them up or not.
Bring them up.
When we were married, we had a reception at a bar of quote straight bar.
There was a lot of people there who had no idea there was going to be a gay reception
that day.
I know I surprised at least one person and that guy probably went home that day and said
you'd never believe what I saw today.
So yeah, and like do you think that would have happened 20-30 years ago?
Probably not at a sports bar no it would have been in a gay bar.
Yeah.
So, and I imagine that was 10 years ago yeah because our 10-year anniversary is coming down
that'll be next year.
But yeah, I mean that was 10 years ago and I think things just kind of better.
But I think a lot of it really besides the gay bar is not peeing around as much.
I think the online apps are really just returning to the gay community.
I think it's just so easy for people to meet that way or it's before the only way you could
meet it is by the ones who a gay bar and now I mean me and you met online so but so yeah
I guess there are pressures in the community that have sex?
There always have been and there are always people who feel they need to rise above it.
And sex is what men do and I mean we're not like you said what if we change that word sex
to love?
Or we can do both actually I mean I think do you think love is harder achieved than sex?
Yeah, it takes a lot more work yeah you have to be ready for it yeah you have to be receptive
for it.
Anybody can have sex and then kind of like bowling.
It's an activity like you said and I think the gay men are notorious for that.
I don't know if it's good or bad but it's in some cases it's way and bam thank you thank
you sir you know and then other people don't like that.
When you realize it's the only thing that binds us together it's Yeah, harder to criticize
it, I think.
Well just that is an activity.
But sex as an activity yes is it's important.
But there in turn I think that was part of the problem with the epidemic was the openness
of having sex with numerous partners.
I understand there were a lot of I guess you would say bisexual men who only had sex with
men because there was no danger of pregnancy but no, I don't think there's more pressure
on the gay community than there is on the straight community that is sex.
You would you've tipped your toe in that water I haven't so you would know better than I.
I mean it's God I was a filthy dog when I was, I've been with more women than I've been
with men who I know it's icky but I mean I played that whole macho try to be macho with
me not sure if I could get on the bedpost, you know but that was a long time ago and that's
what I was really trying to hide my sexuality.
I'm struggling not to shame sex here because I don't want to.
No there's no reason too.
We just have to recognize that's the most important thing to the gay community and the thing
that vilifies us to those who oppose us to the straight community they supposedly don't
object to love they object to sex and I guess in a way they object to it for a straight
people too.
When they try to pass abortion bans and people say well people are going to get pregnant
and they go well you shouldn't be having sex.
Yeah so, they don't want to have they don't want anyone else to have any fun if they can't
have any.
Oh yeah and that's so, a stupid answer and it's any easy answer it's an easy out we'll
just don't have sex it's we're built over it's a primal instinct that we all have.
It's in our DNA.
It's in our DNA I mean it's even you know gay people we don't procreate obviously.
It's still there there's still sexual attraction you get releases of dopamine and serotonin
and all that stuff from having sex some people are addicted to it I mean but like you said
it's in our DNA so to say that you just don't have sex it's ridiculous and you can't
fall in love with everybody so that's why I love it so special it's you know the love
I have for you is different than the love that I have for my mom my sister the love I have
for you is a lot different than the love that I have for some of my old fraternity brothers
it's a different kind of special kind of love so it's just you know you just don't fall
in love with anybody you can't go and have sex with pretty much anybody you know as long
as you're too willing participants that's why we refer to it as an activity so I'm glad
you brought up the little part how does age work indicate community it doesn't it doesn't
it's I mean you really haven't been part of the community but I imagine things you know
before when I go to the bars I would get hit on and I imagine that would be a lot different
now I went to the bars I probably want to be hit on probably you know maybe so, not I don't
think I'd be hit on as much but I was hit on quite a bit before when I went out to the
gate but it's probably same with you or with a different crowd I think yeah so but I don't
know if it's true but I have heard that a gay hook-up app like Grindr I don't know if it is Grindr
or not but they send you a simulated death certificate when you hit 50 oh that's pleasant so
I guess for me and you were dead then we're dead-on arrival dead for a long time guess it was could
we find each other when we dead hey I just turned 50 no but I want to change anything because I love
you I found you there's supposedly you know standards of beauty and youth but when I was that age I
didn't like the young guys I like the older guys yeah; I don't think I fit into that stereotype so you
always like that he's a Baehrs yeah yeah; yeah, same here yeah twinkish men aren't my thing obviously so I
got you so I'm a Baehr do you have a gay community and it can be very nasty when it comes to age yeah, I
remember a gay birthday card it said something like um we were gonna get you a cake with a candle for
every year that you've lived but we didn't want you to have to look into such a bright light oh well
that's yeah, funny but yeah but no it can be very nasty because I remembered even being when I
would go to the gay parts and seeing some of the younger guys how they would treat some of the older guys
there and it was only later at night because the boy that I used to go to was Jason and had an older
crowd playing the tag and that's when I would go like really evening you mean like dismissive or
you mean like actually mean dismisses but then they could be mean to like if the gay like if the older
gentleman came up and just wouldn't leave them alone they could get nasty real quick and I felt
no need for that at all and I really really wanted to associate with those people because I was like
you're gonna be there one day too that's okay there's an old expression that from time to time you
should let an old troll suck your dick because someday you'll be an old troll and it's just it's
maybe you're gonna be there one day too and you're not hot shit that's the biggest thing is
looks at fleeting you know and most people that are like that are just shitty people
and once a shitty person like that it's that's the hard mold to break and once you're a shitty person
you're pretty much a shitty person the rest of your life unless you make a concerted effort to change
that so I didn't see much of it down there but I you know it's the crowd got younger it's the
like an older you would see it more often and then you know me I guess consider it was one of the
looking guys, they always try to band together and I went up fall into that group because I'm
gonna put up with their shit and to me someone with a bad attitude like that who's just nasty I don't
care how good looking they are they just they're ugly people and so I would just steer clear people
like that but I guess I did too yeah how out are you come out me like I was joking with people I'm
like I'm out of rainbow flag band warrior you know I'm not loud and proud but I mean I don't hold
it in my family and all my friends though I don't keep myself in the closet when it comes to work really
everybody I work with knows like you everybody my work knows everybody who knows me personally
knows that the thing about being out is those there's always new people to be out to yeah guys,
like I was gonna say I mean it's I don't think every customer I have knows I don't get I mean I have
a pride bracelet on but you know you know I don't I don't wear I don't have a tattoo in my face it says
okay you know people get to known this day whenever I mention my husband there's this
little pause and known this looking their face like oh yeah, I know something about you now yeah
well, I think it's only 20 because I always get oh it's okay and I usually cheat here is and I've
responded and said last time I checked and then I asked for your permission because I don't I don't
care if you have a problem with it, it's your problem you know but that cracks people up when they
oh, it's okay did I ask for your permission that's my first response it's exactly like that when
a minister asks you what your faith is and you say atheist and they build pods for a second they'll
go well I guess that's okay yeah and then an answer your permission either so it's kind of like
when people are like how's my leg doing, I said I still haven't found it but yeah, I know I would
consider myself out um it's nothing me too no so but I'd like yeah, like I said we're not pillars of
our community we're not going to speaking engagements we're not very big activists yeah, those days are
yeah, in the long past yeah there's a river here how long will I have to argue in the gay community
not very much at all anymore yeah, I've never really was involved and that's one thing I should have
regrets I guess but well you did a lot you mean you yeah, put your heart and soul and it's I mean
and it's still emotionally took its toll on you yeah it really did so I mean when you do it all over
again, yes good don't even have to think about that man good I'm going to quite you feel that way
I'm very proud of you again, know that though well like I don't know like in a career there's a time to
you know let the younger people take over do you think they're doing a good job um
but I think they have to um the religious evangelists are trying to grab so much into power
um if there was nobody to oppose them, I don't know where we'd be as a society it's scary isn't it, I think
they're scared too um I just read Gen X which is like 12 to 24 isn't it Gen Z Gen Z sorry uh yeah
where Gen X um polls of it, that community have found an over half worship no god and over 25 percent
consider them part of the gay community and I think these evangelists see their days are numbered
yeah, I'm good an 30s they're an they're power grabbing right now it's like I get last
gasp of the dog well good because you know what they want they're kicking they want to eat it too
do you know what I mean in what way I mean just everywhere I mean you look at Trump you know
this guy flip-flops on everything and then he's if you want to know what Trump's position
is on something find out who he talked to last yeah but I mean you know the evangelist's year
love him but he's so far from a Christian person it's no quote-unquote Christian person you know
you can't tell me that man's never not paid for an abortion you know I mean um just this
stuff that he's done he's men not what you would call a Christian person you know I mean
but they men love him I mean didn't you men told me about how in Iowa they were interviewing them
except people leaving them I wasn't told of over Trump god men made me vote for Trump or
some bologna like that it's men it's men yeah do you see what I'm saying yeah, I think the quote
was something like um I didn't pick Trump uh God yeah, God pick Trump yeah and it's just a bunch
of bologna is a bunch of smoking mirrors and it's just it's sickening to be honest but we're not
gonna talk about that because like we can go on and on and on and on and on but this isn't the correct
right show so okay the next question we've already covered how God are you two friends' family people
at work well okay so if you could change one thing about your relationship with the gay community
what would it be I'd still like to be a little involved that's all I'm gonna say um maybe
just as like an elder statesman or something a president emeritus um just so that you know the wisdom
of my generation can be shared yeah, I agree sometimes we should probably look into them um what would
you change about the gay community or change it in yourself I like to get involved in it yeah maybe
even if it came down to volunteering for the pride parade um with a route you know for pride
month and volunteering for that for the event um well last year we put an ad in the pride guide
and I understand that a booth at the festival came with that we didn't know that until
so, until late and then you had your surgery so yes so, we didn't even get to go to the parade or
or anything but um I think I would not be able to volunteer for so, them because
we'll probably do the same thing in this this year we probably will have a booth
yeah, and you want to do the booth this year yeah if it's if it's an option okay so many people
actually, listen to it to us yeah, I don't we don't really do it for anybody but ourselves
yeah, um I suspect we would we would probably or people would probably come across us and say yeah
I've heard of that I've listened to it before um because we us kind of are yelling into the void
yeah, and the void keeps sending us to voicemail yeah there's nothing wrong with that like you said we
do it for ourselves so okay so you have I think we both like to get a little more involved
we should look into sage again um at the time um I last looked at it the guy who ran the club his
husband had just died they were pretty much stopped having any meetings or anything okay so I
should look into seeing how they're doing right now yeah yeah yeah, I think it'd be a good idea
because it's something I mean they seem to have a lot of events when we did speak to them a lot
they've looked at their calendar like every week they hit bowling and coffee and dancing and
and I mean it's something we don't have to go to all the events were yeah
so, we can pick and choose what we want to go to from there and there must be a really large
membership in order to support so many sub activities yeah so but yeah let's look because at
first, it's overwhelming it's like we have to go to all of these things and then it was bought
through our attention that now first, we're mandatory that it's pretty much just you come and go
to please which is good to hear okay so what is your favorite joke right now do you know why
gaming always go out in odd numbered groups though I don't know why one can be
because they can't even cause here's dork
sorry so it's again you got many zingers we hope you enjoyed episode 89 of the Baehr and
and crew a podcast.
This is Bear.
- And crew a.
- Goodbye.
You have been listening to the Baehr and Curadh Podcast, a production of the Land of Awes
Information Services. We can be contacted via email using the address podcast@awes.com
and Awes is spelled A-W-E-S.
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