Hello from Baehr and Curadh, a podcast from the Land of Awes Information Services.
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I love you, Curadh.
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This is episode 141 of the Baehr and Curadh podcast.
We're going to ask, what happens if gay marriage is overturned?
Okay.
What is gay marriage?
There's no such thing.
Okay.
The marriage that we have is the same marriage everyone has.
Right, yeah, it's no different, yeah.
But in this episode, we're still going to refer to it as gay marriage.
Yeah, just because--
It's easier.
It would help people understand what we're talking about, I think.
Okay.
Yeah, yeah.
Our marriage is the same as everybody else's marriage.
And then the same way.
Divorce.
Kidding.
That's really what we always wanted.
Exactly.
The same right.
We didn't want special rights.
We just wanted the same rights as everyone else.
Exactly.
Okay.
Well, the Trump administration in Project 2025 wants to overturn Obergefell versus Hodges,
the Supreme Court decision that legalized gay marriage in the USA.
You think that'll happen?
I think they're going to try their damnedest.
Who even would have known that Roe vs. Wade would be overturned?
Exactly.
And you think that one's only been around since Obergefell.
I think they can--
Legalized was 2015 when it was totally recognized, gay marriage-- So it's only been about 10 years.
Yeah, because we got married and then it was legalized a month afterwards.
So, they're going to try their damnedest.
The Trump says he's not, but he's going-- they're going to try it.
So, another reason they hate him.
And I think we should use that hate.
Yeah.
Like we did during the AIDS pandemic, burying your head in the sand is not going to help.
And I don't want to admonish people.
But I want them to know that it's okay to be angry and you shouldn't have to avoid the
news.
No, no.
Like, my friend did.
During the elections he said he didn't turn on the news for a month, and get on
social media, nothing.
And then he said that he goes, he goes, but I'm not going to accomplish anything but burying
my head in the sand.
He goes; I need to be aware.
Get angry.
And use that anger.
Don't let the anger use you.
Yeah.
It's true.
It's kind of like the protests we saw yesterday.
Yeah, we-- I had no idea.
How did I not know that there was a Trump protest in town yesterday?
Turned it made the news.
It did.
Made three and ten.
Yeah, we were proud to drive through the middle of that when our thumbs up and I'm sure that
a lot of other people had other digits extended to them.
We had our thumbs up.
And waving hello and yelling at them, cheering them on.
So.
The right for gay couples to marry is based on two Supreme Court decisions and a federal
law.
Did you know that?
Mm-hmm.
Most people think that there's just the Obergefell decision.
Okay.
So-- which is the one that actually-- I won't say legalized, but it de-legalized all of
the anti-marriage--
The DOMA and all that legislation.
Mm-hmm.
Okay.
So, the United States versus Windsor, Edit Winsor challenged, the federal government's
definition of marriage as only between one man and one woman under the defense of
marriage act (DOMA).
And I don't-- I think that snuck past a whole lot of people.
Mm-hmm.
I think so too.
She was right to sue because they were married.
I think they got married in Denmark.
Okay.
So, the Full Faith and Credit clause of the Constitution says that you have to recognize
marriages in other states, and by other states they also mean other countries.
Oh, okay.
They were legally married, and the federal government would not recognize it.
So, they had to pay separate taxes and to pay separate everything.
Really?
Well, that's too bad.
That's horrible.
Well, they sued and won, though.
So--
Okay.
And that was long before Obergefell.
Mm-hmm.
Well, not very long ago, was it-- or-- it doesn't matter.
I think it was a couple of years before.
Yeah.
Okay.
Well, the Supreme Court ruled in Windsor's favor, invalidating DOMA and requiring
the federal government to recognize any marriage legally performed.
Mm-hmm.
Okay.
So, at that point, you could either go to a state that recognized or didn't not recognize
gay marriages, or you could go to a country and get married and then--
Yeah, and then it would be--
Come back.
--recognized here.
Overfeed versus Hodges, the Supreme Court ruled the right to marry is a fundamental
right inherent in the liberty of the person under the due process clause of the 14th amendment.
Couples of the same sex may not be deprived of the right and liberty.
Sorry, I had to read that, but I wanted to get told the words exactly right.
And you're fine.
So, yeah.
At that point, that invalidated every anti-gay marriage law in the-- in the country.
Okay.
So, they got rid of DOMA?
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Good.
That's good.
So.
And that, that was finalized in 2015.
Yes.
Okay.
So that-- that essentially made the gay marriage legal.
It made it recognize--
Yes.
--respect for marriage act.
In response to threats against marriage equality, Congress passed the Respect For Marriage
Act, codifying both Windsor and Obergefell into federal law.
And that happened during the Biden administration.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
I'm glad that they got that passed then because it certainly wouldn't pass down.
No.
Now that it's codified though -- or kind of would have any pronounce it, I thought once something
was codified, you couldn't reverse it.
Right.
And Congress can reverse it.
By two, sorry.
By majority vote.
Right.
Okay.
A super majority vote, though.
Mm-hmm.
Okay.
But that is mainly in the case that the Supreme Court gets overruled or changes its mind
later on.
Okay.
So now to-- well, I'll read the next one.
To remove the right to gay marriage, Overfelt would have to be challenged, and overturned.
And this would allow some states to outlaw gay marriage.
Okay.
But it would still be--
Look, recognized federally.
Okay.
So, you-- Okay.
To remove federal recognition of gay marriages, Windsor would have to be challenged and
overturned as well.
And this seems unlikely.
And the reason they say it's unlikely is because almost everything that Trump has been doing
has been saying, we want to turn this over to the states.
Mm-hmm.
And then it would be just the exact opposite.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
So then--
So, if he does try to do that, people can say, well, you said... of course this mind changes
... like the wind.
Yeah.
So.
Okay.
35 states currently have constitutional amendments or statutes banning gay marriage.
I didn't realize there was that many.
Yeah, the majority of them.
Just like abortion.
Did that-- that many, though?
That's a lot.
I thought it was like half and a half to be honest with you.
I didn't realize it was the 35 of them when they were trying to--
At the time, Overfelt was put in place, I think only about half, but since then some
states have said, oh, we don't like this, and we hope that we can get rid of this, and we
want to have our laws already in place that it's banned.
Mm-hmm.
Huh.
35 of them have done that.
Wow.
Okay.
The remaining 15 states either have laws protecting gay marriage or lack any laws banning
it.
Okay.
This patchwork of state laws would be similar to how abortion laws are now.
No.
So, like now, a woman has to go to a state that allows abortion to get an abortion.
A gay couple would have to go to a state that allows marriage to get married.
Okay.
Well, the thing that sucks-- I mean, the thing that sucks for the people, the women who are
trying to go to other states to get -- abortions, they can be prosecuted for crimes.
Coming back to their--
There are states that are-- yes, that are-- trying to put in place laws that you can't
travel to another state to get an abortion.
Yeah.
And I don't see how that could possibly pass.
Yeah.
They would have to overturn the Full Faith And Credit clause to do that.
Okay.
Which would take a lot.
Yeah.
That would mean amending the Constitution.
We know--
Not going to happen.
Yeah.
The Equal Rights Amendment took 50 years.
Hmm.
Yeah.
Okay.
Invalidating existing gay marriages would be complex.
Marriage licenses do not always require gender disclosure, making it difficult to identify
same-sex couples retroactively.
I believe on our marriage license; it doesn't ask for our genders.
In fact, the license said male name and it had-- and female name and it crossed out female.
Remember what it meant?
And put both of our names in there.
Okay.
They didn't have forms ready.
Okay.
At the time.
So, there's no checkbox that says you're male or female.
Okay.
But we have a marriage license and nobody has any-- from a database perspective.
They don't know.
Nobody has any idea whether we're male or female.
Hmm.
Why?
Well, I didn't marry no female.
Okay.
Well, the reason for saying that is if they want to overturn it and if they want to make
our marriage--
Null...
Null.
They would have to spend excessive resources to research every marriage that's happened
in the last ten years to figure out which ones were gay marriage.
Yeah.
Just because you couldn't tell by the names.
The way politics is in Kansas, I don't-- maybe they would be so spiteful to allocate money
to do that.
Yeah.
You never know.
For a state that says it's broke all of time.
Yes.
In some states, marriage license are issued at a county level, meaning different formats
and storage systems exist.
I believe our state is sort of like that.
I think it is a state database, but I think it's administered by each county.
You don't go to the state courthouse to get a marriage license.
Okay.
To the county level.
Yeah.
To the county courthouse.
Come.
That would make sense.
It would be a significant burden for state and federal governments to locate and revoke
legally recognized marriages, which is pretty much what I just said.
I can see some Bible-belt states saying, "Oh, we want to spend millions of dollars to just
ban these marriages."
Yeah.
Just a spike.
That's a spike.
Yeah.
Especially with some of these Bible-thumping governors.
Yeah.
Because I think they'll get one more vote that way.
Exactly.
And.
So.
All right.
If you are married, there are some things you still could do.
Still should.
You still should do, I'm sorry.
Create or update your will to explicitly name your spouse as a beneficiary.
We have done that.
We did.
Come.
All right.
I establish a trust to safeguard assets for your partner.
We do not have a trust.
I mean, there is a family trust, but that's for the level above us.
Yeah.
Really?
We probably should do that.
Okay.
We can get ahold of Jim.
Mm-hmm.
Good.
Ensure powers of attorney are in place for healthcare and financial decisions.
We have that.
We've done that since before we got married.
Mm-hmm.
So, we need to update it.
No.
Oh, so it's okay.
Okay.
It's still valid.
Okay.
Update your beneficiaries on bank accounts, retirement plans, and life insurance policies
to explicitly name your spouse.
Mm-hmm.
Now, when you get one of those policies, it's usually through work.
You can just leave it blank and it will say in there, it will go to your spouse.
Mm-hmm.
It doesn't say otherwise.
But all you've got to do is check the box and put the name of your spouse in there.
No.
It explicitly says, that's who the money is to go to, when you die.
Okay.
Good.
Which is what I did.
Okay.
And I think the policy that I have, and my life insurance policy, that I did have, through
a Bruce that it's still valid, I think you're in the beneficiary on that.
Mm-hmm.
So, you didn't even know such a thing existed.
Mm-hmm.
See, you're not the only, you're not completely sugar daddy.
So, is that it for the week already?
Are you done?
Yeah.
Oh, wow.
Okay.
Well, what's the joke this week?
Claiming that somebody else's marriage is against your religion is like being angry at
someone for eating a doughnut because you're on a diet.
It's not a good joke, but it's very, very, very valid.
Very good point.
Very, very good point.
Weird.
People keep saying this country is based on religion.
No, it's not.
It's based on freedom from religion.
From religion, yeah.
That's why people came here.
So, yeah.
All right.
This was episode 141 of the Baehr and Curadh Podcast.
This is Baehr.
And Curadh.
Goodbye.
You have been listening to the Baehr and Curadh podcast, a production of the Land of Awes
Information Services. We can be contacted via email using the address podcast@awes.com
and Awes is spelled A-W-E-S.
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